I am curious what kind of dps numbers high end rouges are doing? I have 264 weapons, and mostly 264 gear, still have two 251 pieces, and still sporting bracers of swift death. I am breaking 12k close to 13k on Saurfang, and 9k on other bosses with lots of switching (non heroic).
Just curious if I am on Par, or seeing where I am at. Thanks.
Rogue discussion
Re: Rogue discussion
16 Apr 2010 20:47
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Diahi
- Posts: 202
http://www.wowmeteronline.com/rank/clazz/dps/rog/9/0/3
And as for our rogues you'll have to search from here:
http://www.wowmeteronline.com/browse/gu ... 1#calendar
Those should give you an idea of the numbers. Some of the logs have some kind of cheese as in chain hysteria, so don't pay attention to those :P Each 264 -> 277 upgrade should yield about 75-150 dps in a standstill fight.
@The previous posters. First of all, use EJ, read my previous posts for links and such. Most of the answers can be found there by reading one of the first topics. Sheets are the best tool you can have for optimizing.
Yes, rupture is superior by a little bit now as it can crit.
Eviscerate was better than rupture because of armor penetration.
Eviscerate ,however, is NOT the reason armor penetration is good.
(blatantly copied from someone in EJ, I confess. =))
I usually run something around 3s5r without the SS glyph, 4s5r with it. Throw in some eviscerates while keeping up maximal rupture uptime.
As for enchants on boots, I'd probably go for cat's swiftness if I wasn't an engineer. The movement speed pays off.
Also, use potions of speed as thistle tea is worthless. 1st 1-2 seconds before combat and the 2nd one during.
And as for our rogues you'll have to search from here:
http://www.wowmeteronline.com/browse/gu ... 1#calendar
Those should give you an idea of the numbers. Some of the logs have some kind of cheese as in chain hysteria, so don't pay attention to those :P Each 264 -> 277 upgrade should yield about 75-150 dps in a standstill fight.
@The previous posters. First of all, use EJ, read my previous posts for links and such. Most of the answers can be found there by reading one of the first topics. Sheets are the best tool you can have for optimizing.
Yes, rupture is superior by a little bit now as it can crit.
Eviscerate was better than rupture because of armor penetration.
Eviscerate ,however, is NOT the reason armor penetration is good.
(blatantly copied from someone in EJ, I confess. =))
I usually run something around 3s5r without the SS glyph, 4s5r with it. Throw in some eviscerates while keeping up maximal rupture uptime.
As for enchants on boots, I'd probably go for cat's swiftness if I wasn't an engineer. The movement speed pays off.
Also, use potions of speed as thistle tea is worthless. 1st 1-2 seconds before combat and the 2nd one during.
Re: Rogue discussion
17 Apr 2010 17:39
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Narville
- Posts: 1
Hey im a combat rogue just simply looking for the best UI for a rogue if anyone could post a list of addons that are sufficietn to a better rogue raiding experience that would be great!
Re: Rogue discussion
18 Apr 2010 10:44
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Krematoria
- Posts: 2
- Location: Swe
Narville wrote:Hey im a combat rogue just simply looking for the best UI for a rogue if anyone could post a list of addons that are sufficietn to a better rogue raiding experience that would be great!
Classtimer and Basiccombopoints, 2 addons that has anything you need.
Only god have seen the end of war!
Re: Rogue discussion
19 Apr 2010 05:10
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Caito
- Posts: 1
@Rakez
I've been playing around with the spreadsheet and I'm confused as to what I should be doing next. Every time I move a gem around or change 1 thing every gem suggestion changes. Basically, I've been ruptureless until now but I figured I'd change over to rupture to up my DPS a little so I was playing around with the spreadsheet to see how I should re-gem my gear. Basically told me to change everything to 20 agi and put 10 agi/10 hit in yellow slots so I start doing that and about half way through it says to change everything back to 40 ap and 20 ap/10 haste in all the yellow sockets...
Any help or input would be greatly appreciated
http://www.wowarmory.com/character-sheet.xml?r=Arthas&cn=Cilix
I've been playing around with the spreadsheet and I'm confused as to what I should be doing next. Every time I move a gem around or change 1 thing every gem suggestion changes. Basically, I've been ruptureless until now but I figured I'd change over to rupture to up my DPS a little so I was playing around with the spreadsheet to see how I should re-gem my gear. Basically told me to change everything to 20 agi and put 10 agi/10 hit in yellow slots so I start doing that and about half way through it says to change everything back to 40 ap and 20 ap/10 haste in all the yellow sockets...
Any help or input would be greatly appreciated
http://www.wowarmory.com/character-sheet.xml?r=Arthas&cn=Cilix
Re: Rogue discussion
19 Apr 2010 10:03
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Diahi
- Posts: 202
The value of nearly every stat depends on how much of the other stats you have so there can be points where agility bypasses ap and such.
This post is pretty informative on the usage of the sheet.
http://elitistjerks.com/f78/t39136-comb ... ost1620926
This post is pretty informative on the usage of the sheet.
http://elitistjerks.com/f78/t39136-comb ... ost1620926
Re: Rogue discussion
19 Apr 2010 16:32
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Auriayon
- Posts: 1
According EJ the spec with the highest potential dps stat sheet wise anyway is Mute spec but whenever i watch a vid posted by a "Top End" guild and it contains a rogue PoV or if i look at wowmeters the greater majority of the rogues seem to be combat be it evis spam or rupture spec or both.
I only started playing rogue since the new year after a lengthy abscence from the game but i am wondering if there is something that these rogues know that i have not read ne where. I have been playing Mute and my DPS although far from the best is by no means low (12-13k on stand and deliver fights ranging down on the more movement/target switching fights) but since i see all these rogues that i assume having been playing the class longer than i and are better at it than i. i am puzzled. since i am guessing that at least a good portion of the top end rogues are min/maxers i am assuming there is more to their decision than they prefer the play style. So i would love to know your reasons for playing combat over mute.
I only started playing rogue since the new year after a lengthy abscence from the game but i am wondering if there is something that these rogues know that i have not read ne where. I have been playing Mute and my DPS although far from the best is by no means low (12-13k on stand and deliver fights ranging down on the more movement/target switching fights) but since i see all these rogues that i assume having been playing the class longer than i and are better at it than i. i am puzzled. since i am guessing that at least a good portion of the top end rogues are min/maxers i am assuming there is more to their decision than they prefer the play style. So i would love to know your reasons for playing combat over mute.
Re: Rogue discussion
19 Apr 2010 20:53
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clabbehala
- Posts: 5
I was just wondering something:
Someone of the rogues in paragon told us in this thread that a good rogue addon is basiccombopoints, and that it's a must.. well, i though, why not.
After the DL i got kind of disipointed and exited at the same time, my bad feeling where aimed at the BIG grey box in the middle, so i went to setting and thought, ofcourse can i remove it, but noooooo...
I saw in you LK 25m HC that the rogue GM Seja had been able to remove that grey box, how did you manage that?
http://www.wowinterface.com/downloads/i ... oints.html - The DL page!
// Zowíe
Someone of the rogues in paragon told us in this thread that a good rogue addon is basiccombopoints, and that it's a must.. well, i though, why not.
After the DL i got kind of disipointed and exited at the same time, my bad feeling where aimed at the BIG grey box in the middle, so i went to setting and thought, ofcourse can i remove it, but noooooo...
I saw in you LK 25m HC that the rogue GM Seja had been able to remove that grey box, how did you manage that?
http://www.wowinterface.com/downloads/i ... oints.html - The DL page!
// Zowíe
Re: Rogue discussion
20 Apr 2010 07:37
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Diahi
- Posts: 202
The estimates posted in Mavanas' thread in EJ are from 3.3 and do not take the rupture crit change into account so they are a bit flawed. According to Aldriana's sheet combat is about 500 dps ahead of mutilate when both are in best in slot gear. Now this might not be exact but should prove combat to be atleast a bit ahead of mutilate in a standstill fight.
Even if combat was worse for standstill, it's still a lot more flexible with big cooldowns and their synergy with fok etc. while mutilate is just single target rotation without a single decent cooldown (Cold blood is worthless). There are so many fights in ICC where you can get double damage for blade flurry or need to burst down a single/multiple targets as fast as possible where AR comes in. That is more than enough to push combat ahead. Add in the better target swapping capability and not having to use vanish for dps purposes it should be a no-brainer to play combat if only you have the chance to do so.
For me, however, it was a little different when my combat gear was over 700 dps behind my mutilate gear. I was able to switch specs once I got DBW (which is like 200-300 dps better than any other trinket for combat) and I think it might be better to play mutilate until you reach the area where your combat gear is around 300 dps behind or less. As with switching to all arp gems you're pretty much cut out from playing mutilate again (while ap gems enable you to play both specs, allbeit a bit less optimally).
Even if combat was worse for standstill, it's still a lot more flexible with big cooldowns and their synergy with fok etc. while mutilate is just single target rotation without a single decent cooldown (Cold blood is worthless). There are so many fights in ICC where you can get double damage for blade flurry or need to burst down a single/multiple targets as fast as possible where AR comes in. That is more than enough to push combat ahead. Add in the better target swapping capability and not having to use vanish for dps purposes it should be a no-brainer to play combat if only you have the chance to do so.
For me, however, it was a little different when my combat gear was over 700 dps behind my mutilate gear. I was able to switch specs once I got DBW (which is like 200-300 dps better than any other trinket for combat) and I think it might be better to play mutilate until you reach the area where your combat gear is around 300 dps behind or less. As with switching to all arp gems you're pretty much cut out from playing mutilate again (while ap gems enable you to play both specs, allbeit a bit less optimally).
Re: Rogue discussion
20 Apr 2010 09:49
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LaaLA
- Posts: 2
clabbehala wrote:I was just wondering something:
Someone of the rogues in paragon told us in this thread that a good rogue addon is basiccombopoints, and that it's a must.. well, i though, why not.
After the DL i got kind of disipointed and exited at the same time, my bad feeling where aimed at the BIG grey box in the middle, so i went to setting and thought, ofcourse can i remove it, but noooooo...
I saw in you LK 25m HC that the rogue GM Seja had been able to remove that grey box, how did you manage that?
http://www.wowinterface.com/downloads/i ... oints.html - The DL page!
// Zowíe
On their killvid of LK heroic you get to see maeil pov and not seja (sejta? im confused here) And the addon he's using to track combopoints above his head is named Blink's RogueHelper.
The "must use" statement he just said that classtimer and basiccombopoints is two good addons to show you the snd,rupture etc. timers and combopoints easier. If you play better without them you are not forced to use them.
About the grey box you can see, on my screen it disappears when im locking it..