4.3 Brief Fire Guide

[hailofthechamber]

hey, was just wondering how exactly you get that perfect combustion so to speak.
I often find myself with combustion off cd but with no pyro procs or if they do proc it doesnt crit or the ignite is low.

So my question is: is it better to hard cast those pyros in order to get the needed ignite when combust is off cd? or is there something im missing and if so what is it?

please get back to me befor wednesday :D cheers

[Emo]

Guromin,

Just wanted to thank you again for all the time and effort you put into giving back to the community. You have helped me before, and I'm sure you will again in the future, thanks again, Guromin!!

-Emó

Insert customary response of happiness when I see a guide you've posted

[meth]

Yes I'd like to thank you as well for this excellent guide and the constant responses to questions afterwards. Always good to see forum users who are so helpful and active. Keep up the good work and have fun in 4.3.

[Jinzaak]

hey, was just wondering how exactly you get that perfect combustion so to speak.
I often find myself with combustion off cd but with no pyro procs or if they do proc it doesnt crit or the ignite is low.

So my question is: is it better to hard cast those pyros in order to get the needed ignite when combust is off cd? or is there something im missing and if so what is it?

please get back to me befor wednesday :D cheers

Totally agree with you, with fire being heavily RNG based theres very little room for any such luxury to wait for a big ignite. IMO its better to have 3-4 decent combustions in a fight rather than 1 or 2 good combustions.

[Guromin]

@Emo

Please to help help and will continue to contribute to the community!

@Meth,

Thank you as well! I hope you enjoy 4.3 as well :)

@Hailofthechamber

The perfect combustion is something a lot of theorycrafters are currently working on. There isn't really a solution right now. I have some theories of my own that I'm testing, but nothing is consistent enough for me to consider revealing. Anyway, you shouldn't hard cast Pyroblast to get a combustion (usually). I can think of only a few exceptions to this rule:

1) Before you pull the boss it's a good idea to start with a hard Pyroblast
2) I sometimes hard cast a pyrobast when I feel like it's my "last chance". When some phase where a boss takes insane damage is about to end or when several buffs are all about of ware off. In theory this isn't a good idea because the net damage from Fireball is greater than that of Pyroblast, but it's worked too many times for me to not use it.
3) Same idea as pulling the boss, but instead the boss is immune now and won't be when Pyroblast hits. Same would apply if the boss takes normal damage now, but 100% more when a Pyrobast hits. I'm thinking mainly of Hagara right now. Right before the transition phase ends I pop all my trinkets, use a potion, lust, and hard cast pyroblast. My best attempt yeilded a 76k ignite and I have yet to understand how or why.

Casting these Pyrobasts has been successful, but not as successful as my crazy ignite theory. Pyroblasts will sometimes get me an ignite of 30k (if I'm lucky), but with this theory my best was 85k in Dragon Soul.

Here are my crazy theories about Ignite:

This is going to be long and ramble on so be prepared. Please comment if anyone has thoughts or ideas!

The best ignites I get, not the 20k ones or 25k ones, but the 40k+ ignites all start as 20k ignites and then build.Never does it jump from no ignite to 40k. There is always a pre-existing ignite on the boss. The situation is similar to Alysrazor ignite damage. When chain casting pyrobasts at 1 second each ignite stacks in an odd way and can build to values over 300k. Sometimes and it feels like randomly I will be fighting and notice ignite just start stacking (while casting Fireball). I have no idea what causes it, but I know that if I cast an instant pyrobast while it's stacking I loose it (keep in mind all of this testing was done on PTR).

So here's my theory:

There are haste thresholds for fire mages that cause ignite to stack. So theoretically, if a mages haste comes within the threshold and all other elements are true (haste doesn't change, same spell is cast, nothing else crit's on it like Flame Orb or Living Bomb) the Ignite will stack and yield a huge combustion. There are a few fights where I've gotten it to work on: Hagara (while Lust and Berking are up) and on Deathwing when the haste buff is active. What makes this so much harder than Alysrazor is the luck factor. There is no guarantee that my spells will crit multiple times in a row. Like I said it's just in infant idea right now and it's only based on my own observations and tests.

On a more practical note here is my general rule for Combustion:

This will change on a fight-by-fight basis. The key to combustion is knowing how long you have before you need to get it on CD. For example on a 6 minute long fight (Ultraxion) there is only a possibility of using 3 combustions: one at the start, one 2 minutes in and one 4 minutes in. While I realize the first combustion will not be cast as the fight is pulled it shows how much time is available before combustion must be used. In this fight (assuming the boss dies at 6 minutes) there are 1.5 minutes that combustion can be on CD and NOT affect the number of times combustion is cast in the fight. Because there are 3 combustions the 1.5 minutes or 90 seconds are divided by 3 to yield 30 seconds. This means that if 30 seconds pass at the start of the fight and nothing good has come it's time to get desperate and settle for a little smaller combustion than anticipated. The same will go for each combustion after. In total the time combustion is off CD cannot total greater than 1.5 minutes or dps is lost. Keep in mind that this is just an example and it changes on every fight. In addition to this the t13 4 set will change these values because it reduced combustion's CD by 50 seconds.

On the note of the t13 4 set here is a little extra information on when to switch. First of all, if your running LFR you should defiantly attempt to acquire the items (even if your in full 391's). The flexibility to switch and gain the 4 set early will be prove to enhance dps early on in the patch. Iiris mentioned in the fabulous 4.3 Normal mode guide that Fire mages should not use 2 397 and 2 384 because it's a dps loss. This is correct. It will sim to be lower in dps, however the reason I request that you acquire those items is because there are some fights where it will be a dps gain. There are some fights in Dragon Soul that make additional Combustions useful. Any fight where combustion can be consistently spread to another target or multiple will make the 4 set a dps gain. More specifically I'm thinking Yor'sahj, but the Black phases are unpredictable and can occur once a minute with good luck. The other fight I found the bonus to be useful on was Hagara. The timing worked out well for me to able use combustion more frequently and during her increased damage phases. If your not sure on what is better do some math and run a simulationcraft to see what is higher damage.

I think I've talked enough for tonight about my wild theory that I continue to work on. Let me know if anyone has experienced similar circumstances.

Thanks to all who read my long posts!

-Guromin

[silco]

how will the 2nd stats look. is it still crit - hast - mastery or?

cause i have been playing arcane sinse the day i hit 85 so not that pro in fire but if fire will be the best specc for some fight i simply have ti learn it and have to play it as good as my arcane specc :-P so can some plz help me whit how my reforge has to look like ?

armory link: http://eu.battle.net/wow/en/character/t ... a/advanced

not a top geared char but not undergeared. so can some help me.. i know atm i am in arcane reforge :-P

[killey]

Mybigignite addon confuses me and I was wondering maybe if you could explain how to use it. I also don't understand what number and how large the number to put into the ignite threshold value box inside the configuration area. I enjoy this information you have given out thus far and if you could elaborate for me a little more I would appreciate it. Keep up the good work.

Killey

[Guromin]

Killey,

I would be happy to elaborate on the settings I use for the addon. The settings can be opened with "/mbi config". The threshold value that I use is 20k. Anything reachable works for this value. If your gear is a little weaker you might choose 18k or 19k, but this setting does not change the performance of the addon. I set this number as the "worst case scenario" ignite. I try to go for at least 25, but I will take 20k+ if needed. My favorite setting for the look of the addon is "Modern", but they all accomplish the same goal. I liked the default settings so I haven't changed much else in the addon, but if you still have a question about it let me know.

Silco,

Gearing for Fire mages is a little sketchy. I can't tell you exactly what to gear for like arcane for two reasons. The first being that your gear will change your stat weights. Secondly, the goal is to reach the haste tick marks (listed on page 1) and then go into crit. In general Crit > haste > Mastery. I think I mentioned this earlier, but it's important to consider that different fights will also change the values. For example, fights with AOE cause mastery's value to be increased. I suggest using Simuation Craft to figure out what your stat weights are or (even better) use RAWR to optimize your gear. Rawr is a complicated program and can be confusing upon first use, but right now I believe it's the best for mage gear optimization. Let me know if you have any questions.

-Guromin

[killey]

Mybigignite addon.

Thank you for so a quick reply.
So when I see the number show in the addon is that when I want to pop my combustion?

[Emo]

In reference to the haste mark ticks on page one the 3rd tick of combustion is 2005 haste, assuming 3/3 NP and 5% raid buff, and 1858 if you are a Goblin.